ROPS testing idea.

I was thinking (I know, shocker) after reading the thread on the Lo-boy talking about mud mower roll overs. It seems a lot of guys on here have had a “close call” or two (*ahem* *cough* Richie *cough* *hack*)

Got to thinking about how I was reading about a NIOSH project that created duplicateable, no welding ROPS for older tractors where alternatives were unavailable.

Putting two and two together, if I were to get a really cheap parts tractor, build a universal, no-welding roll bar for it, test it for structural stability, by repeatedly rolling the thing, and make the plans public to keep you guys from becoming the next Mr. Game and Watch, would anybody do it? I have a good friend who’s brother died by a Farmall tearing up and crushing him, so I’d like to do something to help y’all out.

I have to think about it before voting.  There is more to ROPS than just the roll-over bar.  If you have a ROPS, you have to use the seat belt or the ROPS itself becomes dangerous.  As for a mower sized tractor.  Not sure that would be feasible.

That’s a very fair analysis! My primary thought was that rops without a seatbelt reduces the risk of fatal injury by 70%, from what I’ve read from Nebraska’s studies and my own personal tractor classes through 4H way back when. My goal would be to make something that would be the difference between getting crushed in an overturn and getting, say, a foot pinned. 500 lbs doesn’t sound like a lot, but it can still break a neck.

ROPS is entirely infeasible for the tight trails we run. There’s times when you have to get off the tractor and walk it under a branch or tree. You could imagine having ROPS it would be easy to get pinned between the ROPS and a tree. There is a reason we wear helmets, and it’s not just because some off-road parks require it. I’ve been under a few tractors before and rarely as if the tractor has fallen on you, as you usually ride the tractor all the way to the ground and can brace yourself against it. It’s hard to explain until you’ve done it a few times. Rollovers are just a part of life on these tractors and something you just have to plan for and not panic when it happens.

RichieRichOverdrive wrote:

It’s hard to explain until you’ve done it a few times. Rollovers are just a part of life on these tractors and something you just have to plan for and not panic when it happens.

I've only had one backwards rollover with Bowser due to a hooked in ramp gate falling off the trailer.  Only injury I got was from the trailer catching my leg as the front of the tractor coming back over and landed flat on my back with the tractor on top of me, but was easily able to push it off.  If I had a ROPs on it, I could have potentially got pinned between the tractor and trailer.  It's all hit and miss.

Flatlanders might be able to get away with it. Definitely couldn’t here in Appalachia.

I appreciate all the feedback! Great points all around.

I'm going to vote based on ATLT's with a No.

Outside that, Like the LowBoy, yeah, I would look into a ROPS especially if I was going to be pulling or tugging.  Mowing, probably not unless I was dealing with hills.  I have searched from time to time for a ROPS for my 9n, but I just don't use it enough or in situations where I would need a rops.

MightyRaze wrote:

I'm going to vote based on ATLT's with a No.

Outside that, Like the LowBoy, yeah, I would look into a ROPS especially if I was going to be pulling or tugging.  Mowing, probably not unless I was dealing with hills.  I have searched from time to time for a ROPS for my 9n, but I just don't use it enough or in situations where I would need a rops.

For your 9N,this CDC page may be of interest.

In the test data they say that it is also suitable for the 9N, being as they are nearly identical aside from some minor improvements.

Further technical specifications

@Rustbucket Garage  Yes, I have seen that page.  That was pretty much what I was looking into the last time I thought about it.  I also saw on on the FB marketplace that was a pro built one a few months back.  Like I mentioned, I use the 9n like 2-3 times a year and I have a blade on when I do.

I would be interested in one, though I plan on welding mine  ... because I have a couple of welders :-D

I bought heavy duty cargo racks for trucks at auctions just so I could cheaply buy the square and round tubing of the size I need.

I think it is BMI that sells inserts and couplers so you can build a non-welded roll cage for go-karts.  That might be a good source to use for testing material.

Considering how small a lawn tractor is,  I would put 2" padding into the design because hitting the ROPS or cage with your head and getting seriously injured is not unheard of in off road trucks and you are literally going to be right next to the noggin knocker on a LT or GT.

As in truck roll cages, I would absolutely only tie the seat belt to the roll cage and not the body of the tractor.

A handle on each side of the console or seat area so you can hold on would help avoid the instinct to grab the cage or brace yourself with your hands.

I just bought a side by side go-kart frame at auction, I do not know exactly what it is, I think it is meant for course racing and has two steering wheels. BUT, that thing is very heavy, I can't move it or pick it up without mechanical assist.




 So, I would not go with heavy gauge steel tubing.  I would go with large thin walled seamless round tubing or aluminum. LT/GT tend to be top heavy and unbalanced as it is, putting weight over the COG, will make it worse. You might need to think about ballast. I was looking at the roll bar design, in the pix, and I noticed the bar sits about 12+ inches above where you would expect a head to be on the tallest person.

There's "rules" about this in the go kart community:

- If you don't have a roll bar or cage then you shouldn't be strapping yourself into it because it's better to be thrown from it than be attached to it when it flips over.

- If you have a rollbar or cage you NEED a proper 4 or 5 point harness to grab onto and keep you completely inside the machine in the event of a rollover.

Think about it, everyones first instinct is to brace themselves for a crash or fall. Go to grab the cage or handle, miss and grab the bar instead, that's at the very least a couple of broken fingers. Fall off the machine and the roll bar rolls over you... that's got to be worse than a full machine rolling over you because just the bar would put all that weight on a very small surface area...

Unless you build a full exo-cage with foot guards and a harness you're looking for trouble in my opinion. I don't agree with rollbars on quads either, I'd rather have a chance at using my hands and feet to stop/redirect the machine than have a roll bar prevent me from doing that and maybe taking a limb... no thank you!

@Brianator I 100% agree. The same safety logic applies to dirt bikes and mud mowers. I've rolled Red Stag a dozen times and the key thing is you need to learn how to fall off and not let the tractor land on your leg. Nothing wrong with investing in some MX style knee/shin guards, riding boots, or pants either.

> I'd rather have a chance at using my hands and feet to stop/redirect the machine

Or jump off towards the uphill side. I think on this forum there is a set of pictures from someone that had a running engine land on him and tear his arm up because he did not have a hood on the LT.

I paid attention to that, when testing my new rig I am going to have a hood on before it leaves level ground along with a seat safety switch.

My neighbor had a ZTR (42" Toro Titan) land on him and it took a long time for him to move it off him. He would never wear a seat belt on any mower, so, adding a ROPS to his ZTR might result in the bar hitting him.

The bolted design of the mentioned ROPS is using 1/2" angle attached to the rear axle. We do not have a Ford 1500+ pound (?) cast steel axle to bolt ours to. Plus, it is meant to be used in plowing areas to prevent the tractor from rolling over (flipping) after it falls over on it's side.

I have been measuring frame widths while planning my own frame suitable for a FEL and I would guess many LT GT frames are 11" wide at the rear. So, you have to design a self supporting box that attaches to the frame.

For me, any ROPS over 50# or so might end up being excessive.

In the end, a good helmet, good gloves, and good boots might be the most cost effective means from preventing injuries. That and maybe a secure battery holder and secured hood.

Tube Couplers and Clamps

https://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/COUPLERS-CLAMPS.html

ATTs are by far the most technical, challenging and unpredictable things I've ever riden, I figure that's why I enjoy it so much! Lol

I’m gathering that interest is pretty minimal. My intent was a rear bar for backwards roll overs but those seem to be relatively uncommon I guess. Thanks for the input

watch about the 7 minute mark

https://www.atltf.com/t7163-so-long-fugazi

Don't beat yourself over it @Rustbucket Garage it's the thought that counts! In all honesty a bumper bar to help stop machines from going over backwards is a decent idea, the rear ATV rack on The WarHorse helped me out one day. The tires spun then grabbed while I was climbing a steep mound, threw me on my back (good thing no ROPS to land on) and then stood strait up resting on the rack! Lol. Wish someone had got a picture of that one!