John Deere?

So I'm pretty new to the off-road mower thing and I have a couple Lt models but I'm looking for a gt model to build and have found a deal on some John deere 212's but between searching here and just in general online haven't found anyone building these. Is there a reason for that? It seems that the wheel horses and older sears are the most common I see are these just generally better for off-road builds? Just looking for some input from people who know more about before I spend the money.

People gravitate to the Sears Suburban and Wheel Horse due to their stoutness and GEARED transaxles.  People also like the Murray Widebody and Craftsman that have gears too.  Thing with the Deere is finding a "GEARED" transaxle.  While offroad mowers with hydro trans are doable, just not desirable.  Same with varidrives (automatic).

There are some Deere's out there.  That 212 deere has a 2300 (awesome trans) but does have a variator (varidrive).  I cannot attest to how variators stand up.  Maybe someone else can chime in.

I've had belt slippage issues with my VariDrive since the new belts stretched a little but I'm hoping to overcome it. Before that though it was working flawlessly and was actually really nice to use having speed control at my foot at all times.

Considering the 212 is a 4 speed gear with added VariDrive I wouldn't think it would be hard to ditch the VariDrive and go strait belt/pulley 4 speed BUT I don't know what the underside of the tractor looks like and what would be involved.

Ok yea I knew the varidrive wasn't very desirable but had seen a few people running it and also wondered if it were possible to just eliminate it all together. Also I was wondering if it would be possible to run a vertical shaft engine on one of these with a twisted belt or not? Looking at them I'm not sure there would be room for it or not. The two I looked at 1 doesn't have an engine on it and was told the other needed to be rebuilt and figured if it were possible to just use a motor I already had I could save some money or is that more hassle than it's worth.

@Double W Cross Ranch has a 110 with a variator and muds it sometimes.

Running a vertical doable.  I did it once with my craftsman that was originally horizontal.  The key is that idler next to the engine pulley. 



I ended up needing another idler where you see that "j hook" looking guide.



My Murray KAL has a belt twist too.  Sorry could not find an actual pic of the tractor.  It's out back and it is raining.  It has a different design on the twist since the clutch is next to the engine.  It also makes use of an idler but at the rear this time.



Like I mentioned, it is doable, just takes some patience to get things lined up so you don't throw your belt.  Belt guides everywhere helps!  Also, once the belt gets worn a bit and stretched.  Those guides will save you from the belt coming off.  If you can stick to horizontal, that would be easiest, but I understand working with what you have.

Ok awesome thanks for the info I think unless I come across something else I'll probably go ahead and pick these up then and see I can do with em.

MightyRaze wrote:

Running a vertical doable.  I did it once with my craftsman that was originally horizontal.  The key is that idler next to the engine pulley. 



I ended up needing another idler where you see that "j hook" looking guide.



My Murray KAL has a belt twist too.  Sorry could not find an actual pic of the tractor.  It's out back and it is raining.  It has a different design on the twist since the clutch is next to the engine.  It also makes use of an idler but at the rear this time.



Like I mentioned, it is doable, just takes some patience to get things lined up so you don't throw your belt.  Belt guides everywhere helps!  Also, once the belt gets worn a bit and stretched.  Those guides will save you from the belt coming off.  If you can stick to horizontal, that would be easiest, but I understand working with what you have.

Yeah, even just throwing a hobo freight engine in there should be enough, at the speeds these thing usually run a 212 honestly should be fine and a 420 would be great.

Yea I did think about that because I have a brand new 212 sitting in my shed I just wasn't sure if it would have enough power or not but yea I guess I could try that on it and see how it does.

I don't know about a 212, they're only rated for 7-8hp I think? Sure it'll WORK but will be the tractor equivalent of a 4 cylinder Mustang...

Yea that's kinda what I had though. I want to have enough power to get up a hill. I'm sure I can figure something out for a motor really my main concern was that I hadn't seen anyone really messing with the 200series for off-road builds and didn't want to jump on getting them if they weren't going to be what I was looking for.

So I haven't decided on the John Deere yet and still been looking and I've found a c-121 wheel horse with a blown motor but guy said it does have an 8 speed trans. Opinions on if this would be better than the JD?

I don't see a 8 speed listed but if it's gear driven and a decent price I'd grab it up if I were you, much better than the JDs you're looking at and desirable in this community.

Yea tractor data says 6 speed so im not sure. Hes asking $250 for it so im going to go look at it this week hopefully.

I noticed that too and probably why they said 8 speed (3 speed hi/lo plus 2 reverse). Those Kohler K series are pretty stout motors but they seem to like to snap connecting rods, they're not terribly expensive to rebuild if the block is still good so if the tractor itself seem to be in decent shape it could be worth it. The days of finding $100 GTs are getting pretty slim around here I can tell you that!

Yea it has the 14hp kohler engine and yea he snapped the rod. Yea I was wondering if that might be what he meant by the 88speed. He also has a c-160 for sale but I think it's a hydro.

Cmoore wrote:

Yea tractor data says 6 speed so im not sure. Hes asking $250 for it so im going to go look at it this week hopefully.

Looks like a great start to a build, 250 for a blown motor seems kinda high. I’d offer 200 and that seems reasonable. Those kohlers have cast iron blocks so it may be savable, probably oversized piston and undersized rod and you should be good to go.

Yea I was thinking it was a little high with that as well but figured if I could get it for 200 id be alright with it.yea hopefully if I get it the block will be salvagable if not  im sure I can figure something out I have a buddy who builds pulling tractors and always has some motors laying around so i might have to talk to him

So I went ahead and got the wheel horse it seems to be in pretty decent shape but it is missing the brake band and the rod that connects to it and also has an axle seal leaking but I plan to pull that apart to lock it anyway now I just have to figure out a motor for it. I'm thinking I might still go ahead and buy the parts jd212 I can get it for $50 and swap the front axle on it bc it has 1in spindles and I believe it's a little wider also. And I figured I could save the peerless 2300 in it and figured there might be some other things of use on it but we'll see.

Pics or it didn't happen! Lol

I tried posting some but for some reason it didnt work i dont know how to work this stuff but i think i figured it out now

Wow nice score that does look decent! Are the tires are good as they look in the photos? If you're comfortable with engines it couldn't hurt to open it up and have a look, unless it ate a valve there's a decent chance it's rebuildable and would probably cost the same as finding a decent used engine, maybe cheaper?

This forum has a old school format to it so don't stress over it, if you ever need help or advice feel free to PM myself or @MightyRaze we're here to help not just to entertain! Lol

Hey Mighty can you please link this fella to how you relined your brake band? I may be able to use that info in the future myself!

Ask and you shall receive.

#bandbrake

https://www.atltf.com/t7135-bandbrake-repair-re-line

Oh, and if you need help understanding uploading pics, see the How-to in my signature!

Yea the tires are decent they have some dry rot but not to bad im planning to put those on my jd 160 just have to make some hubs. And yea im actually a mechanic for a living so yea i plan on pulling the motor apart and seeing what the damage is it definetly sounds like a broke rod so we'll see. And thanks for the brake info i talked to the guy i bought it from today and he is a collector of these things and had a bunch of parts and said he had a brake band and rod but i will for sure be using that re lining if its in need. Also he told me today he had a gt-1600 he would sell with a running 16hp v twin for 300. I wish he would have told we this yesterday but i do like the look of the c series better so im undecided on that but i am intrested in that motor. I look at it when i go get the brake parts. And yea ill check out that picture posting how to. Thanks