Murraymountain's Deal Flipping Thread PT2

Ya that is pretty high, good thing you were keeping an eye on it!

I have a running Kohler CV16S which I assume is the same as what you have? Looks the same anyhow. I got it with hacked up wiring but got it sorted out and am not having any charging issues so now my question to you is...where the heck is the diode!? Lol. I don't remember seeing one (doesn't mean it's not there) and never thought twice about it because I thought they were only on non regulated engines (ie old Briggs flathead ect).

This diode, did it come with the tractor or the engine wiring? I know you swapped the Kohler into it, I did the same thing with my Roper Trailblazer. I could be wrong but I don't think there's a whole lot of anything useful to you in the thread but I'd be more than willing to draw a wiring diagram of the engine - tractor for you on Saturday and provide some pictures if wanted?

Brainator wrote:

so now my question to you is...where the heck is the diode!? Lol.

There's a diode of some sort on any small engine with a stator. They are usually right at the end of the connector on the engine side where it connects to the tractor harness. Kawasakis and higher model Kohlers probably don't look like these ones because they are more advanced, but of course, somewhere in there they still have to them lol. They come straight off the stator on most of your common Briggs and Kohler singles and twins like this.



I don't have many Kohlers in the shop but I have an abundance of Briggs engines so I took some pics of those.

This is the one on Alfredo:



This is on a Briggs flathead in the shop.




Back to the case of this Kohler here, I did just think of another possibility... I replaced the dead diode with one from a Briggs engine... perhaps the Briggs engines have diodes that allow more current to flow than Kohler diodes? I have no evidence to back that up aside from they looked different, but maybe a possibility.

The tractor had what I believe was a diode in the engine wiring when I got it, but that was when I was dealing with installing this regulator to convert current to DC and I broke it in the process. So I installed another harness today with a factory diode for one with a regulator installed, but that was the diode that was bad. So I put the Briggs diode on and this is my issue now.

I would say a diagram would be great, but I would need it with every single detail in it which would require you to cut back all of the wrapping around the wires and everything, so don't worry about it. If I can't get to the bottom of this during fall break I'll take it to college and we'll figure it out there because they deal with all sorts of weird electrical stuff.

I maybe missing something, but Kohler's don't have diodes to my knowledge.  All of them that I have seen have rectifier regulator like in your picture which takes the place of a diode.  2 outside prongs direct from the stator (ac), center is DC to battery charging etc. Personally, I think they are safer way to turn AC to DC than a diode.  I've seen diodes fail.  Then again, I have seen the rectifier regulators fail too.

Don't worry about me buddy I'll help you get it sorted out, I want to fire up and run the Trailblazer anyways so if anything we're doing each other a favor and tomorrow is the day!

@MightyRaze sure they have diodes but IN the rectifier (generally 3). I did a little research last night and I believe his tractor came with a 17.5hp single B&S although I could be wrong but that would explain an inline diode.  

Either way something is going to happen here! Lol

Sorry I was a little delayed but here is some info to hopefully help you.

I couldn't find a diode in the official Kohler wiring diagram and I don't have one on my rig so I think you should consider removing the one you have as you don't need it and I'm not sure if it will cause an issue being there.

Here's a quick diagram I drew of my setup

When I ran it for the first time (on my bench) all I hooked up was the red from the SAM and the red from the fuel bowl solenoid and she ran, I twisted them together and ran a single wire from them to the B+ on the ignition switch when I installed it into the tractor.  Where things got interesting is that there are the wires coming from the stator to the AC ports on the voltage regulator and wires coming back out in the same spot on the AC ports, I have no idea what they're there for so I cut the tips and capped them. Don't mind one is yellow it's been repaired and is actually a white wire.

If you're unsure what to do with the 12v black coming from the VR you can literally attach it to battery positive terminal to keep it simple as it's the charge wire. No diode needed there as the diodes in the VR will prevent power from feeding back into the stator.

I really hope this helps you out!

To answer a previous question, yes this tractor had a 17.5 Briggs and did have an inline diode on it, but it was coming straight off the alternator as most briggs do. So when I took the motor off, the diode went with the old motor. When I put the Kohler on, I went and found a stock Kohler wiring harness that was setup for a regulator. When I installed it into the system, there was an inline diode in the same place it would be on a Briggs. I know it wasn't from a briggs because this was an unaltered harness setup for a Kohler. I didn't think anything of it because I was worried about wiring up the regulator. Here's the kicker. When I put in the battery, sparks would fly everywhere. If the regulator is where the diodes are, current should have stopped at the regulator and not made it to a point where it could create sparks as if I was touching the hot side straight to metal. But when I cut the diode out and replaced it, the sparks stopped completely. I fired it up and it was not charging, so I flipped the connector on the regulator and it started charging, but that is when it started overcharging. So that's where my loss is at. The diode fixed my original problem, but now presents me with a new one. Could I have possibly blown up the regulator when it was sparking... or when it was connected backwards?

And on this motor, there is no SAM and no place to put it either.

I did have those two extra wires coming from the two end terminals on the regulator... I left them disconnected too.

The black wire in the middle post of the VR is connected into the harness and runs directly back to the battery. That is the wire that has the inline diode in it and the one that causes the sparks when there is no diode. That's what confuses me.

One other slight possibility, the ground strap on the VR is a little loose because of the way I had to repair the fan shroud. I could put a bolt with a nut there and tighten it better... Just a thought.

No SAM? Lucky! When I bought mine (non running) for$25 all the wiring was cut close to the engine. I meant to and forgot to check my charging voltage if you can believe that....

I guess you could've damaged the VR, based on what I just read in the service manual it sounds likely.

Brianator wrote:

I guess you could've damaged the VR, based on what I just read in the service manual it sounds likely.

Yeah that does sound probable. I'm gonna order up a new one tonight. I talked to a friend who owns the local repair shop and he said a burned winding can also cause overcharging. So I popped the flywheel off and had a look at it. It wasn't really burnt at all and looked to be in great shape actually.



What I did find though were several magnets coming off and one broken in half and a very very sketchy flywheel key. So I need to snag one of those too. Wondering if the broken magnet could have also caused overcharging? Maybe? I'm gonna leave the stator in it and just clean it and fix the magnets and replace the broken one. Then I'll see how it does. If the problem still exists, I'll slap the new VR on it and that should do it.



Anyway, I pulled the Nissan into the shop yesterday because I really need to get started on it and the weather has been crappy lately and I've had a cold, so being in the rain AND cold weather is not a great idea.



I cleaned the bed out and stuffed the grille in it's face. I'm waiting for it to fall out and shatter on the ground. We'll see how long that takes. I did find Datsun labelling on the back of the valve cover I think it was. Also found out it is the Z24 engine and confirmed 5 speed. I poked around with the test light inside and out and couldn't find power anywhere, so I traced the small wire going to the starter solenoid and cut it and extended it to reach the battery post. Touched it against it and it spun over. I picked up a coil and resistor for it and am going to wire it up tomorrow I think. The truck has basically no power so I have to wire my own system independently from the truck harness. The Z24 uses a dual ignition system, and both coils have been robbed. 2 new coils cost more than I want to put into it, so I'm gonna just run it off of 1 bank of plugs. Then hopefully all it will take is rigging up a fuel tank and freeing up the clutch and I'll be able to take the ol' girl for a spin. Ideally.


As for the Explorer, I got about an hour and a half of work in on it today. Made some good headway on getting to those valve covers.



Got some more to go but once it's all back together, it'll have brand new valve cover and plenum gaskets, plugs, fresh power steering fluid and fresh coolant! Definitely some well needed maintenance for the ol' gal.

I would just JB weld the magnet back in. Make sure you put it back in the right polarity/orientation.

If you have AC when the engine is running then the stator is probably fine. As far as I know, these voltage regulators are just a full wave rectifier, which should not allow any backflow. I don't know why they would have another diode on the output of the thing. Could be something sacrificial if the VR ever happened to get in the way of high current? Seem unlikely.

Now while the diode on the output of the VR should be unnecessary, if it's in the correct direction then it shouldn't affect the charging circuit.

Hard to diagnose this stuff without it and a meter in front of me.

The plan was to put the magnets back on today, but turns out, I'm missing one of the ones needed because one of them was broken. I had extras but wouldn't you know it, none of them were the right ones. So I gotta go to the junkyard and try to find the correct one. I also have a new flywheel key coming in so I guess I don't need to be in a rush until that comes in.

Personally I'd just grab a whole flywheel, stator, and charging system while I was there. I know briggs had different amperage systems with different stators and may have had different magnet arrangements.

Yeah Briggs are all completely different. Has to be off a Kohler Command. I don’t want to get a flywheel if I can save this one because I know I’ll need another Kohler flywheel in the future. And the stator seems good. I don’t mind doing the work again to replace the stator if need be but at this point I’m just curious to see if it’s one of the next two steps that takes care of it so I know for future reference. And hopefully save a little money lol.

Welp, the Nissan has met it's fate. I wired up the coil and went through setup after setup changing little wiring details and checking for spark again and again. Cleaned under the distributor too and found an ignition module instead of a condenser and points. I wired it up several different ways but never got spark. I've tried enough ways of wiring it to feel pretty confident that something other than a coil is the reason for no spark. It also looked like someone had dug into the distributor at some point during the time the truck sat. So, being that I'm not willing to put more than what I did into it and it needs to be gone by the New Year, I called it and wrapped it up and pushed it outside and threw it on Marketplace for $500. I've had people try to buy parts off of it but I want to sell the whole truck cause it needs to go.


Since the truck was out and the barn got cleaned, I pushed the Explorer in and worked on it some more. Pulled the door off and stripped it a little. Then I continued working on pulling the valve covers. I got the passenger side cover off and plugs out as well. I need to clean the surface tomorrow and then I'll put the new gasket on. Then I'll start on the driver side.

As I was pondering and carrying out my plan to bend a wrench to reach the nut on the inside of the body to get the bent hinges off, I snapped the wrench and shot it through one pane of glass on the window. It was bound to happen eventually, but I'm surprised it took 5 years to finally break a shop window lol.



Anyway, I've been working on the Explorer each day pretty much since the last post. Bouncing between the brakes and engine work. I took the back wheels off and took the rotors and calipers off. One side came off easy but the other was a real fight. This is the driver side... You can barely even make out the emergency brakes... I just took them off and am not gonna put new ones in because changing them is such a pain in the butt and I'll probably need new cables anyway... and parking brakes don't get used all that often, so it's just not worth the hassle in the least. The next owner can have that done if they want.



This is the passenger side. I had to beat the living crap out of the rotor everywhere possible, heat it several times, use blaster, then cold shock it, and that finally did it. Took me a good 20 minutes of beating to get it. Then I pulled the emergency brake out and found some rust holes in the splash shields.



Been working steadily on the valve covers. They were really dirty inside and out, so since I was already there, I decided to clean them up and paint them. I'm doing one side at a time. Got both surfaces cleaned up pretty good cause I don't exactly love cork gaskets lol.





While I was there, I went ahead and changed the plugs. I'm onto the second cover now so both banks are finished as far as plugs go. Definitely glad I changed them... They look pretty rough.




Definitely like the blue a lot better. Gonna try to hit the engine real good with some degreaser once I get it back up and running again.



The second cover has some rust in one spot... Enough to break the mount. The rest of it is pitted worse than the other cover, so I'm gonna repair the mount with JB weld and then do a thin layer of it across the whole surface to fill the pitting and then sand it back down flush with the metal surface. Also gonna fix the splash guards with JB weld too.



A new problem I've encountered is what I believe is a power steering leak. Could just be because it's leaning forward, but I doubt it. Hopefully it's something simple.



Anyway, that's where I'm at now! Just bought me a new flaring tool and small pipe bender and am gonna start doing the brake lines as soon as I get the JB weld finished and curing. Going to a junkyard tomorrow to try and scout out a door.

Got the splash shields on the rear patched up. I cut an oil container and JB Welded the pieces on. While I was there I sprayed it with black paint and also broke the bleeders free and wire wheeled the pistons in the calipers as they were pretty rusty.




Then I attempted to make a brake line that connects the rear calipers... I did alright after some trial and error. It's not pretty, but it'll get the job done. I was going to do the line that goes from the master to the rear, but it was only rusty from the beginning of the gas tank back. So I left it because it wasn't leaking and I didn't want to tackle it because I would have to drop the tank.



Then I installed my new rotors and pads.



Then I wire wheeled the inside of the wheels from corrosion and and oiled them up and installed them and set it back down on the ground.

I was also working on the valve covers the whole time I was working on that. I got the driver side repaired, cleaned up and painted. Everything is installed now.




When I took the ignition coil off, I broke the mount that is used as a ground for it if it even uses a ground. I assumed it did. The mount is on the exhaust manifold and in a tight spot and I was gonna have to cut and drill to fix it. So I didn't even give it the time of day. Instead, I installed a wire to move the ground to the alternator mounts if there is a ground at all.



Anyway, I topped up the coolant and power steering and gave it a test run. It did not want to start. Finally it did, and it ran terribly. Backfires from the EGR, sputtering, lagging, etc. I decided to let it run because I wanted to get the thermostat open to get the coolant flowing. Once it started getting warm, I could smell onion. It just got worse, so I knew it was the cats. Then I started smelling paint burning. I remembered from when the Hummer had 2 misfires, it would dump fuel into the cats and they would get red hot and start burning the paint underneath. So I looked under, and sure enough, the cats were red. So I shut it off. I'm hoping I didn't just destroy my cats, but I need to get the issue fixed first. I'm pretty sure it's something with the spark because it's obviously getting wayyy too much fuel. So I'm gonna grab a coil today and see what it does. I changed the plugs too, so that probably has something to do with it.

That leak turned out to be power steering. I took a line off and put thread sealer on it and that fixed the issue. Also got the broken exhaust hanger welded up, the rearview mirror reinstalled, the 12v accessories I got for it installed, a new vacuum hose harness installed, and the rear door handle replaced as it was rusted beyond repair.

I said in the last post I was going to a junkyard to find a door, well I indeed did find one. It's green even. Different shade but not far off.



It's off a 99. I've been trying for a few days to get it on. Well, it's on the car, but it's too far forward and rubs the fender hard. So hard that if you forced it open, it would crush the door and fender. I've been trying redneck ways to fix it and am getting somewhere but it's just really time consuming. I'll have to adjust it after I get it clearing the fender. The issue I know I'm having is that the frame of the body is bent out and I can't get it even remotely close to it's original shape because it's a structural part and is not gonna be fixed with a sledge hammer... and the car would have been totaled if I had taken it to a body shop, so I have to find a way to work around the damage and make the door fit.

Anyway, there's the update. Today I have an exhaust leak to fix, sway bar links to do, an ignition coil, working on the door some more, and possibly working with those front brake lines. Oh and I gotta call the old owner and get my title.

That running issue sounds like an issue my parents had with a Grand Marquis they had back in the 90's. My dad drove it to the dealership but ended up having to tow it back home because they couldn't figure it out. My dad threw some part at it. Couldn't seem to get it either until a guy at the barber shop told him to replace the O2 sensor. That's what fixed it. It ran way to fat. Barely idled and ran rough. Blew black smoke and wanted to flood before the sensor change.

Hmmm. I did hear one thing about the O2 sensor. Let me put a video up real quick.

Pretty sure that beast has a MAF on it ya? Clean that sucker with the proper stuff they're known to get funky and generally be really expensive. Being a OBD2, if you don't have a scanner that shows live data you can go through a process of unplugging sensors one by one (including the O2 sensor(s). It will cause the ECU to run a pre set value and may help you narrow it down. Crankshaft position sensor or a spun balancer can also cause funny things like hard starting and improper fuel injection timing. Before I got too far into it though I would check and clean every single ground because it's free and you never know what you could find!

Another basically free thing to do is to unhook the exhaust in front of the cat(s) to be sure it/they aren't getting plugged up. It happens

Dealing with storage issues on my phone currently and college is starting back up again so the video never happened. My apologies.

All good advice... Thanks guys! However I got it figured out. I went back to double check the firing order and somehow I misread it. Had the driver side bank completely out of order. Made total sense to me with everything that it was causing. It was the one thing that could easily solve the massive array of issues that were happening. Anyway, I changed them back around and it ran a whole lot better after that!

Anyway, added in some little accessories to attract the younger crowd... also has the 12v FM/bluetooth transmitter so now you can have Bluetooth music streaming and calling.



Also finally got the door on and adjusted.



Now I'm dealing with brake lines. Got the front ones changed and ended up with a leak on the front passenger. You can see where in this picture.



So my automatic assumption was that the junction was leaking, so I replaced the rubber hose. So now everything from the ABS module to the caliper is brand new. I was confident that would take care of it... but nope. It leaks from the same place but now worse. I looked very closely at it while someone was pressing the pedal, and it sprayed up from the threads... not between the line and fitting, but the between the actual threads of the line fitting and hose fitting. I'm baffled. Only thing I can think of is that the fitting could be the wrong size? I don't know anymore.

Anyway, we're getting close here. Things left to do:

Fix brake fluid leak
Fix exhaust leak
Charge AC
Get a battery
Get title signed over and inspection
Detail

And possibly:
Fix broken engine temp gauge
Replace window motors

After that, it gets sold.


On another note, we're picking up 4 new tractors tomorrow! None will be mine unfortunately, but I'll still just put em up here so y'all know they're here lol.

Explorer update! I decided I've put enough work into what should've probably been a parts car, so I'm not gonna touch the temp gauge or window motors or a/c and the like. Things that are more than a simple fix. I think I managed to fix the exhaust leak today and also diagnosed the no reverse lights. Needs sockets and bulbs. Got the bulbs but need to get sockets tomorrow and finish that up as well as get some glue and stick the rearview mirror back on. Also got it inspected today. Gonna use the battery I have to sell with it and go get a new one when I sell it. Got the brake line leak fixed! The pedal is still soft, so hoping I can get that fixed tomorrow. Then we'll drive it home and detail it up real good and get it up for sale once I get the title and that should be the end of it.


On another note, my brother picked up a nice load of mowers for $100! Was one of the sketchiest drives yet for sure.




One complete Ford YT16, another Rally with an oppy and 820 identical to the one he has that goes like 30, an older MTD Bolens that actually didn't need that much. Already runs and cuts after a good days work put into it. And also a newer Troy Bilt identical to mine. Missing a motor. Other than that it's in great shape.


My Troy Bilt is in need of 1 flywheel magnet and a flywheel key. That's what's been holding me up on it. Haven't been able to get out to the junkyard. BUT, little did I know, my parts Kohler engine has a flywheel on it, so hopefully it has some good magnets and a good key. Then I should be able to finish up this Troy Bilt and start working on the Deere a little.

Wow that Ford itself was worth it! Nice haul.

The thing that caught my eye... Is that green painted tractor a Sears FF20? Does it have a pressure lubed briggs OPPY?

Brianator wrote:

Wow that Ford itself was worth it! Nice haul.

Sure was! He’s got it up and going now. Unfortunately the Ford was heavily heavily abused. Looked like it got rolled 4 times, bounced off two trees, got side swiped by a car and then stopped front first into a pole lol. Definitely needs a lot of work, but he likes it so much that he decided to sell the Husqvarna and keep this instead and eventually restore it.

MightyRaze wrote:

The thing that caught my eye... Is that green painted tractor a Sears FF20?  Does it have a pressure lubed briggs OPPY?

Not hardly. It’s just Craftsman LT frame with a FF20 hood and GT6000 fenders and floor boards with Rally branding. 18HP non-pressure lubed oppy. And I was wrong on the 820. It was an 801.


Turns out the parts Kohler did not have magnets or a key in it. So back to the junkyard it is.

That sux...

Per  @Brianator ’s request in TMAM thread, I was able to finally spend some time working on tractors again (even tho they weren’t modded ones unfortunately). Got to do everything I could on the JD111 without spending a dime. I replaced the rear wheels and took the factory hubs off and put regular rear rims on and fitted them correctly (I will sell the original parts with it if the buyer wants them). I replaced the old style fuel pump with a new style one since it was dead. I cleaned the deck, sharpened blades, cleaned the spark plug, fixed a vacuum leak, replaced the sump gasket, replaced a front wheel, worked with the wiring for a bit and got it functional and safe, and replaced the massive boat seat with a more proportional L110 seat, etc. At this point it runs and drives good. Needs an oil change, an air filter, a deck shroud and two deck belts.






The Troy Bilt is just waiting on a flywheel key, a magnet for the stator, and a fuel pump because I stole it. Once I get the parts for both mowers they should both be done. Had two Snappers I was gonna wrench on but I felt like doing some rust repair which is rare, so I worked on the F250 cab. I’ll be getting to them Snappers soon tho! Might even give that absolute pile of crap Troy Bilt another go before Spring rolls around. Now that I said it tho, I probably won’t lol.

Nice job man sounds like you put alot of work into it but sounds like it was worth it! I'm not really a JD guy but that is a nice little tractor.